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	<title>Comments on: How long we used to live</title>
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	<link>http://santafereview.com/chronicle/2011/01/28/105/</link>
	<description>Notes for a forthcoming book by George Johnson</description>
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		<title>By: Pedro</title>
		<link>http://santafereview.com/chronicle/2011/01/28/105/#comment-21</link>
		<dc:creator>Pedro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Jan 2011 03:05:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://santafereview.com/chronicle/?p=105#comment-21</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I know it is not very glamorous or intellectually stimulating, but our increase in life expectancy and improved health came from better sanitation, improved housing and nutrition.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know it is not very glamorous or intellectually stimulating, but our increase in life expectancy and improved health came from better sanitation, improved housing and nutrition.</p>
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		<title>By: Dwayne Stephenson</title>
		<link>http://santafereview.com/chronicle/2011/01/28/105/#comment-20</link>
		<dc:creator>Dwayne Stephenson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Jan 2011 02:52:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://santafereview.com/chronicle/?p=105#comment-20</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think short-sightedness is a problem of a piece with cancer. How do we know there weren&#039;t just as many cases of myopia back in the day? I don&#039;t understand why people just assume everyone had great eyesight until humanity started being coddled by effective medical treatment. The case for maladaption is both weak and seems to come from nowhere. 

There tend to be two contradictory, mutually held and widespread beliefs about humans before industrialization-one, that everyone was healthier, because of all that exercise, fresh air, and natural selection, the other that lives were brutish and short because they didn&#039;t have modern medicine and indoor plumbing. 

I assume that recent increases in average lifespan (which seem to be well documented enough) really are probably due to the better nutrition and less stressful environments of modern life. But if that&#039;s true, then it doesn&#039;t seem unreasonable to suppose that something close to contemporary lifespans were possible for those of our ancestors who were lucky enough to live in conditions that nearly approximated ours. It just happens those conditions were rarer, and so fewer people enjoyed their benefits. 

If we had better data on the percentage of people who died in their sleep after living long lives, we could get some sense regarding what the optimal lifespans were before the 20th century. But I suspect getting information like that is going to be a real pain in the butt.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think short-sightedness is a problem of a piece with cancer. How do we know there weren&#8217;t just as many cases of myopia back in the day? I don&#8217;t understand why people just assume everyone had great eyesight until humanity started being coddled by effective medical treatment. The case for maladaption is both weak and seems to come from nowhere. </p>
<p>There tend to be two contradictory, mutually held and widespread beliefs about humans before industrialization-one, that everyone was healthier, because of all that exercise, fresh air, and natural selection, the other that lives were brutish and short because they didn&#8217;t have modern medicine and indoor plumbing. </p>
<p>I assume that recent increases in average lifespan (which seem to be well documented enough) really are probably due to the better nutrition and less stressful environments of modern life. But if that&#8217;s true, then it doesn&#8217;t seem unreasonable to suppose that something close to contemporary lifespans were possible for those of our ancestors who were lucky enough to live in conditions that nearly approximated ours. It just happens those conditions were rarer, and so fewer people enjoyed their benefits. </p>
<p>If we had better data on the percentage of people who died in their sleep after living long lives, we could get some sense regarding what the optimal lifespans were before the 20th century. But I suspect getting information like that is going to be a real pain in the butt.</p>
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		<title>By: Lee Simpson</title>
		<link>http://santafereview.com/chronicle/2011/01/28/105/#comment-19</link>
		<dc:creator>Lee Simpson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Jan 2011 02:48:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://santafereview.com/chronicle/?p=105#comment-19</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I recently heard something similar in bemoaning that Social Security going broke because everyone is living &quot;so much&quot; longer. Turns out the SSA tracks this information and if you made it to 65 in 1940 you might make it another 13-14 years and if you make it to 65 today you have only 15-17 more years to live (on average, of course, for men).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I recently heard something similar in bemoaning that Social Security going broke because everyone is living &#8220;so much&#8221; longer. Turns out the SSA tracks this information and if you made it to 65 in 1940 you might make it another 13-14 years and if you make it to 65 today you have only 15-17 more years to live (on average, of course, for men).</p>
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		<title>By: roshni ray</title>
		<link>http://santafereview.com/chronicle/2011/01/28/105/#comment-18</link>
		<dc:creator>roshni ray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Jan 2011 02:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://santafereview.com/chronicle/?p=105#comment-18</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Very interesting post. I&#039;ve never heard that the increase in life expectancy is due predominantly to a decrease in infant mortality.

In addition to the increasing prevalence of environmental toxins, another idea occurs to me. Perhaps the r...eduction of infant mortality has released the evolutionary pressure on cancer prevention. For example, more people are near-sighted now than they were 1000 years ago not (just) because our lifestyle causes myopia but because the invention of eyeglasses allowed the otherwise blind to survive and reproduce. Similarly, it is possible that the same childhood ailments (or genotypes susceptible to those childhood ailments) are associated with increased propensities for cancer.

That&#039;s my hypothesis of the moment, anyway :)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very interesting post. I&#8217;ve never heard that the increase in life expectancy is due predominantly to a decrease in infant mortality.</p>
<p>In addition to the increasing prevalence of environmental toxins, another idea occurs to me. Perhaps the r&#8230;eduction of infant mortality has released the evolutionary pressure on cancer prevention. For example, more people are near-sighted now than they were 1000 years ago not (just) because our lifestyle causes myopia but because the invention of eyeglasses allowed the otherwise blind to survive and reproduce. Similarly, it is possible that the same childhood ailments (or genotypes susceptible to those childhood ailments) are associated with increased propensities for cancer.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s my hypothesis of the moment, anyway <img src='http://santafereview.com/chronicle/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Dwayne Stephenson</title>
		<link>http://santafereview.com/chronicle/2011/01/28/105/#comment-17</link>
		<dc:creator>Dwayne Stephenson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Jan 2011 02:07:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://santafereview.com/chronicle/?p=105#comment-17</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I had heard that Xenophon (a contemporary of Socrates) had lived into his nineties, but the wikipedia article puts his age in the mid-seventies. I was curious about the monarch question in particular, since it seemed like we should already have fairly good records readily available about that (to the extent that they exist at all). Looking at a short list of French monarchs starting from around 400 AD (Chlodio-Childeric, just from the wikipedia articles, so caveat emptor and all that) We have three monarchs who live past fifty (56, 62, and 64 years of age), six monarchs who live past 40 but not fifty, and three monarchs who do not make it past 40 (37, 16 and 16). There were a couple entries that did not provide age data (presumably there was none) at all. Obviously it&#039;s not a representative sample, and I can&#039;t vouch for the data, but if a quarter of a population of French monarchs spanning between 392 and 721 lived into their sixties, then it seems unlikely that 50 years of age describes the probable limit of human mortality at this time.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had heard that Xenophon (a contemporary of Socrates) had lived into his nineties, but the wikipedia article puts his age in the mid-seventies. I was curious about the monarch question in particular, since it seemed like we should already have fairly good records readily available about that (to the extent that they exist at all). Looking at a short list of French monarchs starting from around 400 AD (Chlodio-Childeric, just from the wikipedia articles, so caveat emptor and all that) We have three monarchs who live past fifty (56, 62, and 64 years of age), six monarchs who live past 40 but not fifty, and three monarchs who do not make it past 40 (37, 16 and 16). There were a couple entries that did not provide age data (presumably there was none) at all. Obviously it&#8217;s not a representative sample, and I can&#8217;t vouch for the data, but if a quarter of a population of French monarchs spanning between 392 and 721 lived into their sixties, then it seems unlikely that 50 years of age describes the probable limit of human mortality at this time.</p>
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